The "Masterkey"

Threads about how water guns work and other miscellaneous water gun technology threads.
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strato_2r5
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The "Masterkey"

Post by strato_2r5 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:53 am

Okay, so I'm currently building my own APH. While looking for optimal nozzle sizes, I came across the "riot blast", which is basically a shot without a nozzle. I thought, since nozzle selectors aren't very ergonomical, why not make a modular shotgun attachment. If you watch Sons of Guns or play Black Ops, you should know they have a "Masterkey." It's basically a mini shotgun that you can attach to the underbarrel of an assault rifle.
The design must be very compact, most likely PR, and not have a nozzle, but still be effective up to 10 feet. Any suggestions for a design?
Sorry if I'm not active much, busy on another forum and another project non-soaker related.

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C-A_99
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by C-A_99 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:57 am

Water gun attachments have never been done very often, mostly because they often end up becoming even less ergonomical than the threaded nozzle selections. Such a 1-shot attachment would also only add weight to the water blaster and take space from the pump.

At one point, I experimented with a Flash Flood's internals (couldn't get the trigger fixed so that's what I did), took a ton of duct tape, and scathered the parts around a CPS 1000. Ergonomically, it did not end well.

If you want to build something like that anyway, you can probably do a mini 2L homemade. Take a pop bottle and put in an intake tube that leads to a manually operated valve, and the pressurized water will shoot. To pressurize it, design it so that it can attach to a piston pumper (homemade or stock) and/or a hose.

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strato_2r5
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by strato_2r5 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:03 am

Okay, I don't know if I'll do it, but I think it would be great for Assassin games, if I can get it small enough. Maybe get a regular water bottle, hook up a Nerf Secret Strike's pump, and attach a ball valve. How's that sound?
Sorry if I'm not active much, busy on another forum and another project non-soaker related.

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cantab
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by cantab » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:05 am

If you play Black Ops firing the Master Key just means pushing a different button. In the real world, firing your water Master Key means reaching for a secondary trigger. If you're going to do that, you may as well reach for a nozzle selector.

The CPS 1500 perhaps shows the way for easy-to-operate nozzle selectors, with just two nozzles and a large protruding lever to switch between them. I'd guess nozzle changes can be done more quickly and reliably with it than with any other blaster, and with skill you could probably switch from 5x to 10x and fire a 10x shot as fast as a Flash Flood user could fire their full-time riot blast.
I work on Windows. My toolbox is Linux.
Arsenal:
Super Soaker: XP215, 2xXP220, Liquidator, Aquashock Secret Strike M(odded), Arctic Blast M, CPS1200, CPS2100, SC Power Pak, 3l aquapack, 1.5l aquapack
Water Warriors: Jet, Sting Ray M, Shark, Argon M, Tiger Shark, PulseMaster
Others: Waterbolt, The Blaster, Storm 500, Shield Blaster 2000, generic PR gun, generic backpack piston pumper (broken), 3l garden sprayer M, 10l water carrier:

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strato_2r5
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by strato_2r5 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:09 am

I know that Black Ops isn't realistic. However, the newer water guns DON"T have nozzle selectors. That's why this could come in handy.
Sorry if I'm not active much, busy on another forum and another project non-soaker related.

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C-A_99
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by C-A_99 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:34 am

Cantab, I thought he was referring to homemade nozzle selects. Rotary nozzle selectors are as ergonomical as can be, though they are not as fast as using secondary triggers.

Rotaries are still the best option IMO. Ideally, they should be controllable at a point close to the end or beginning of a pump (tracked or free, respectively).

For Assassins, there are lots of possible water blaster concealment solutions. The trouble is getting the power for them, unless you can carry a backpack which will give you plenty of room for a huge CPS bladder. (i.e. one made out of stacks of party balloons; those things can be expanded to be HUGE.)

Let's not even get started on how "realistic" Black Ops is. ACOG scopes that never existed in the 60's to 70's, really butchered helicopter controls that manage to be so restricting yet difficult to control and let you crash into cliffs without a scratch, a Max-D 2000 sized flamethrower attachment on the AK-47, a shotgun whose pallets set people in fire, and a Colt .45/M1911 that shoots... grenades. I'll let the examples speak for themselves.

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soakernerd
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by soakernerd » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:19 pm

In my opinion, a water gun "master key" would need the following qualities. Please note that many of these are not realistic.
Multiple nozzles - 2x, 5x, 10x, and riot seem good
Large PC - at least 750 ml
Lots of range - should hit at least 50'
Strap and carrying handle - for ease of refilling
Good stream speed - harder to dodge
nice size reservoir - at least 3L
Compact - no bigger than a vindicator
CPS
Pressure gauge - ease of use

Hmm- The Vanquisher satisfies a lot of these requirements. It might be easier to just drill the fan blast, Kmod it, and call it a day.
Pessimist: These blasters hold no water
Optimist: But their small output means they last just as long
Marketing: Huge blasts of water!
user: I shot it at an angle and it went a whole ten feet!

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chaosfox97
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by chaosfox97 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:49 pm

C-A_99 wrote:...a Max-D 2000 sized flamethrower attachment on the AK-47, a shotgun whose pallets set people in fire, and a Colt .45/M1911 that shoots... grenades. I'll let the examples speak for themselves.
I could probably build those... In water gun ideas though I am working on layering some party balloons. I am having a little difficulty though. Also, what does 1x, 5x, 10x, etc. mean? Could someone point me in the right direction? And with something related to this thread, couldn't you just put another pipe on the PC except... bigger? and then have another ball valve and nozzle at the end of that one?

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soakernerd
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by soakernerd » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:05 pm

1x = 1 oz per second. It originally meant 1x the power of the XP 70.
Pessimist: These blasters hold no water
Optimist: But their small output means they last just as long
Marketing: Huge blasts of water!
user: I shot it at an angle and it went a whole ten feet!

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cantab
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by cantab » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:15 pm

1x equals an output of (approximately) 1 fluid ounce per second.
However, the newer water guns DON"T have nozzle selectors
Oh, I thought you were intending your idea for homemades. If you're intending it as an addon for a stock blaster, then it seems more interesting, albeit still a little gimmicky. Being able to soak someone with a one-time riot blast would be good in casual soakfests. And if you can make it fit on the "tactical rail" on current Super Soakers, it'd be better than any of the "official" gadgets.

To be honest, designing the connections may be the trickiest part. The ideal would I think be a Nerf Tactical Rail connection, Water Warriors Ultimate connections, and a "general purpose" fixing method. Won't be easy to do though.
I work on Windows. My toolbox is Linux.
Arsenal:
Super Soaker: XP215, 2xXP220, Liquidator, Aquashock Secret Strike M(odded), Arctic Blast M, CPS1200, CPS2100, SC Power Pak, 3l aquapack, 1.5l aquapack
Water Warriors: Jet, Sting Ray M, Shark, Argon M, Tiger Shark, PulseMaster
Others: Waterbolt, The Blaster, Storm 500, Shield Blaster 2000, generic PR gun, generic backpack piston pumper (broken), 3l garden sprayer M, 10l water carrier:

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strato_2r5
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by strato_2r5 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:38 pm

As for connections, I'm thinking a strap with velcro that can wrap around the barrel of a water gun. Soakernerd, it doesn't need 50 feet range. It's supposed to be a secondary for close range. It's faster than taking out a Shotblast to soak someone point blank.
Sorry if I'm not active much, busy on another forum and another project non-soaker related.

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soakernerd
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by soakernerd » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:39 pm

I know, I was saying what my ideal multipurpose soaker would be.
Here is a good design for your purposes.
Pessimist: These blasters hold no water
Optimist: But their small output means they last just as long
Marketing: Huge blasts of water!
user: I shot it at an angle and it went a whole ten feet!

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strato_2r5
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by strato_2r5 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:48 pm

Well, if you're at a park, you're gonna need a hose to pressurize it, which isn't a good idea since people need the faucet too. Maybe just hook up a balloon pump to that?
Sorry if I'm not active much, busy on another forum and another project non-soaker related.

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C-A_99
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by C-A_99 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:49 pm

chaosfox97 wrote:I could probably build those...
You could re-barrel an M-1911 to accommodate grenades and have the structural integrity to handle the recoil? =p

I'll admit though, the flamethrower attachment is actually somewhat plausible, but obviously, it has never been done in any war. The VC probably didn't even have any flamethrowers at all. (They wouldn't have had much use for one anyway.)

I contend that the Nerf's tac rails lack the structural integrity to handle anything with very much weight. They're barely strong enough for the foregrip on the Nerf Stampede to work. The main problem is that they work absolutely nothing like real tactical rails; attachments are merely slid on and there's no screw or anything to secure them.

The Velcro strap is an excellent idea, and it just occurred to me that Velcro would likely serve as an excellent holster for sidearms.

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strato_2r5
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Re: The "Masterkey"

Post by strato_2r5 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:52 pm

Well, I used a velcro strap to secure my nerf spiderman dart tag blaster to my recon and it worked great. Ha! A Nerf "Masterkey"
Sorry if I'm not active much, busy on another forum and another project non-soaker related.

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