Need Monster QFD connection specs?

[The--Captain]

I really haven't been in to water guns prior to this, so please be gentle

Amazingly, I snagged an original Super Soaker Monster (which from my research I believe was later called the Monster X - mine looks like this: http://www.isoaker.com/Armoury/Analysis ... sterX.html, and does not say Monster X on the sticker on the other side) from a curbside trash pile. It's got a lot of external scuffs, but it works!

Unfortunately, there was no QFD in the trash pile. I'd like to build my own QFD, but the connections seem odd. I've read some potential solutions, but they all seem to involve using a secondary valve which must be operated by hand, rather than the automated cut-off present in an original QFD. Any ideas?

Thanks,
-Jon

[martianshark]

Wow. A Monster X in a trash pile. That's really lucky.

No QFDs have been made that don't use a valve. You might be able to buy one from eBay or one of us. Personally, I'm looking for a QFD too.

[C-A_99]

QFD's are not hard to build and you can make them better. This can help you get started. All QFD's require a valve of some sort, and the one on my design is manually activated but you can make one that opens by itself when pressed just like the real thing. (One method is to use a check valve, or you can [url=http://www.sscentral.org/homemade/check_valves.html]build one[/one] and use that guide as a starter.

The idea is that you need to be able to get a seal on the Super Charger filler head. Since the head already has an O-ring, this shouldn't be too difficult.

You want the design to be able to be positioned against the ground when filling, or the pressure may result in an unwanted splashdown. Not good if your water war games count accidents and teamkills.

[The--Captain]

My air compressor has quick-connect air supply sockets that don't spew air until you shove an air hose or tool into them. They have a locking ring that snaps into place once the hose or tool is fully inserted, but I'm thinking it would function just like a QFD if I prevented the locking ring from moving (easy with tape or weld). I'm thinking that they might make stuff like this for water, too, but the pneumatic ones should work if I can't find any specifically for water

I already found I could unscrew the entire QFD nozzle from the Monster and will probably look into finding some adapters to match threads with some kind of quick-connect air or water sockets which I will use instead of the existing QFD nozzle, and try to go from there.

If you're interested, I'll post back with results.

-Jon

Edit:

@C-A_99 Hmm - that homemade check valve looks about perfect, since I forgot that if I replaced the nozzle on the Monster that I'd need a check valve on that as well. I guess the only thing left is to find (and maybe ream with my drill press) a PVC reduction fitting so that it fits the nozzle on the Monster. Thanks for making this much easier!

I promise to hit refresh before posting next time

[C-A_99]

I don't see how an air compressor would work. You would have to have the compressor fill up a pressurized tank of water and divert that to the SC filling system. Directly hooking up a compressor to any stock water gun won't do anything. Actually it may do something; damage the water gun and/or compressor. Or if you know how to modify an air compressor to pump water, by all means go ahead. (I don't even know if that's possible)

If you need a portable SC filling solution, the best way to do it may be to use a homemade or modified syringe. Typically used as pool cannons, you can also modify them to fit onto a SC head and pump water in that way. A powerful homemade water gun (read APH or CPH with a very thick bladder) can do the job too, it's just a matter of getting the SC head to connect.

[The--Captain]

No, I didn't mean I would use an air compressor - I just thought some of the quick-connect fittings might be useful (before I saw your nice post about a homemade check valve).

I'm off to the hardware store with my Monster nozzle to see what I can find in the PVC section - wish me luck!

Thanks,
-Jon

[The--Captain]

My homemade QDF is a partial success. It doesn't leak, and *does* fill the Monster (and does not leak after the Monster fill nozzle is removed), but there's a catch. It doesn't just start filling when the nozzle is inserted - you have to finagle it just right by slowly removing the nozzle almost all the way and then it starts filling (and somewhat slowly - it takes 10 to 20 seconds compared to 2-3 seconds using a different method [see below]).

I'm thinking the check-valve is causing problems. Although it seals perfectly (i.e. doesn't leak water) under full hose pressure, I'm thinking maybe some weird hydrostatics are coming into play, since I tested the QFD fully assembled but without the rubber valve in place, and the Monster filled very quickly, with the nozzle fully inserted.

Any ideas? I built my QFD using the homemade check valve post as a guide, but I used 3/4" PVC -> 3/4" threaded connections (instead of 3/4" PVC -> 1/2" threaded connections), and then reamed out one of the 3/4" threaded ends using a 3/4" bit in my drill press (I doubt it would be possible with a hand drill) so that it has an actual 3/4" inner diameter, which seemed to match the outer diameter of the Monster nozzle. I also shortened the reamed end so that the Monster's nozzle would physically depress the check valve when fully inserted (I may need to shorten it a bit more - maybe that's the problem). The other 3/4" threaded end fits nicely onto a garden hose, after adding a garden hose male <-> male adapter.

Yes, I had to use a slightly thinner O ring on the Monster nozzle to get it to fit better.

Your thoughts are appreciated.

Thanks,
-Jon

P.S. I've got pics, but no website to upload them from - any suggestions?

[cantab]

I already found I could unscrew the entire QFD nozzle from the Monster

If you can do that, then you could replace it with a hozelock-type fitting. They're commonly used for garden hoses (at least here in Britain - do they have them in the US). You put a female connector on the hose end with a valve, and a male connector on the blaster.
Only drawback I can think of, besides possible difficulty putting the new filling connector on the blaster, is these thing's probably aren't rated for numerous insert/remove cycles. But it's only the female connector I can see breaking and that's easy to replace.

[Fredcompany]

They seem to be used for switching between several different hose ends/sprinklers/etc so I don't see why they wouldn't be made for numerous insert/remove cycles.

[The--Captain]

I'm actually having pretty good luck after adding a center pin to my QFD (which is easy to do since the valve stem has a nice round hole in the center. I just need to tweak the length (and maybe slim the stem of the center pin a little) and it should work really well, I believe.

I'll keep you posted,
-Jon

[The--Captain]

Complete success! I threw out the solid center pin and stuck a length of Bic pen down inside the valve stem, after drilling 8 holes in the piece of Bic pen for better water flow, and now (after some careful trimming of the pen piece to the proper length) I have a fully functional QFD that works just like the original! (The piece of Bic pen depresses the check valve on the Monster and the homemade check valve at the same time, since they are pushing against each other on each end of the pen piece - try sticking a Bic pen shaft [after removing the end of the pen] in your Soaker's filler nozzle and you'll see what I mean)

I attach it to the hose, turn on the pressure, and no leaks/drips. I shove the nozzle of the Monster in there, it makes a satisfying faucet-like water-flowing sound, and it fills in around 3-4 seconds (probably closer to 3) - I'm assuming it's filled when it makes that whining noise, which I'm guessing is the overpressure safety valve squealing. I remove the nozzle, and the only little bit of water that comes out is what was in between the valve stem and the nozzle (i.e. very little).

I will try to post pics (and a link to a YouTube video proving it works, if desired, and maybe a diagram). This thing works so well I'm wondering how close mine is to the original design of the Monster QFD.

Thanks for all your help - once I saw that makeshift check valve, I knew what had to be done I'm actually amazed it was this easy - I read a lot of inconclusive posts about people wanting to buy or build on of these before moaning about it myself

Now I just need to build a ground-mount for it - I now realize there's a reason those original QFD's mount on the ground - so you don't wear out your arm holding the QFD against the fill nozzle.

-Jon

[The--Captain]

Here's a photo of the parts:



The assembled unit without the Bic pen piece:



The assembled unit with the Bic pen piece:



The assembled unit connected to the Monster (no hose attached):



If anyone is interested in a video of it in operation, an exact parts list (I used different ends and a different sized valve stem), and/or a description of the assembly process (it differs very slightly from the generic homemade check valve instructions), then please let me know.

-Jon

[C-A_99]

Nice and simple solution you got there. I don't think I tried the 3/4 female adaptor, but a friend previously found that he was able to fill SC's from the hose directly. However, a sure fit is more reliable.

One possible issue with your design: the hose needs to be held on very well or the pressure will blow it off. I had this problem with my own VHS and ended up going with a minor redesign where I added a tee so that the whole thing could be placed on the ground for reliable SC filling.

If you encounter this problem, you may be able to fix it by adding an elbow, but from the looks of things, you may need to re-buy a lot of parts to do that since the pipe was cut VERY short.

Edit: My bad, you can fix the issue simply by removing the adapter that connects to the hose, attaching an elbow to what you have, and re-taching the hose adapter to it. Sorry.

[The--Captain]

LOL - I was thinking the same thing.

[C-A_99]

Sometimes, the simplest of solutions are just what you need. Is your QFD working well now?