Super Soaker Central forums

insanitys_engineer · 06-08-2006, 07:35 PM

Riddle me this before I go to bed:

Everyone is using pre-shaped containers for the PC.
Joanna ardway's penguin picture has a gun that looks awesome. Problem is, how to style a homemade gun, and get the PC in?

What if you got varnish, or that plastic spray putty, and made a sheet of 3/8" ish ply waterproof. Use the plywood to build the chamber into the styling of the gun, so the outside wall of the PC is the outside wall of the gun.

Problems to discuss:
Sealing: will silicone bathroom sealant on varnish be enough?
Physics: Will a square corenred tank affect the flow in the PC, and does that matter?
Strength: Would the wood hold? Thin nails all around the edge, with epoxy glue was my plan. Opinions?

If wooden tanks and soaker styling have been discussed elsewhere I apologise, but if not this could be interesting.

Ill post some sketches tomorrow, or next week.

Silence · 06-08-2006, 08:20 PM

It's a good idea, but the main problem, in my mind, is actually being able to shape the exterior. The fact is, most DIYers who end up building their own soakers are concerned about the performance rather than about the looks--and, in fact, having a plain PVC exterior can be pretty intimidating.

However, I have thought about such things, and the easiest method in my mind is to simply use duct tape to cover the empty spaces between tubing. You can also use cardboard paper towel tubes, wood, or anything else for convex portions, as long as you connect everything with duct tape again.

However, for more internals accessibility (admittedly hard due to the cement and unnecessary due to the rock-solid reliability), I would just prefer leaving everything open. Being the person that I am, though, I would really find a nice paintjob to be interesting; I have been searching Nerf forums for methods on doing paintjobs like Baghead's ones. He really should write a guide for all the sparkly paintjobs and everything...

supersoaker · 06-08-2006, 08:20 PM

Epoxy should work, though I've never used it personally, as long as it doesn't eat through the wood (?)

And while we're on this topic, what's the maximum of mL hot glue could hold as a Pc? I tried 1 L it didn't work, and I'm trying 355 ml will it work? if not what will?

Silence · 06-08-2006, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by supersoaker

Epoxy should work, though I've never used it personally, as long as it doesn't eat through the wood (?)

And while we're on this topic, what's the maximum of mL hot glue could hold as a Pc? I tried 1 L it didn't work, and I'm trying 355 ml will it work? if not what will?

Epoxy won't eat through the wood, but I'm not sure about more reactive materials such as styrofoam. All I know is that, not only does it create an extremely effective seal, but it becomes incredibly hard--so it can be used to block up wide openings with ease. However, CVFs on heavily K-modded soakers sometimes result in the epoxy plug being shot out, but such force won't be experienced in a nozzle.

I don't understand your second paragraph; are you saying that the hot glue used to seal your PC malfunctioned when you pumped 1L of water? If so, then that isn't enough information; the pressure is the only relevant factor, but we'll need to know the total PC volume to get the pressure. However, if you used a standard 1/2" pump, then there couldn't be too much pressure within...

If you're having problems with hot glue not holding, then I guess that just manifests the power of PVC cement. Why use hot glue when cheap PVC primer and cement is much more effective and is recommended instead? I understand that it's probably easier/quicker to use a hot glue gun, but this just proves that you need to use the right stuff. Trust me, the seals will hold with the actual PVC cement in place--and it is strongly suggested that you use primer, too.

supersoaker · 06-09-2006, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilentGuy

I don't understand your second paragraph; are you saying that the hot glue used to seal your PC malfunctioned when you pumped 1L of water? If so, then that isn't enough information; the pressure is the only relevant factor, but we'll need to know the total PC volume to get the pressure. However, if you used a standard 1/2" pump, then there couldn't be too much pressure within...

Yep, I guess I'll have to go buy some, though the little bottle is working, alright, I filled the PC with water, (It's just a 7-up bottle, I can't find any reducers, and I've looked everywhere!) I lifted the gun up (I was filling it on the ground) the bottle fell off, I guess it's not strong enough. I don't know if this is normal or not, though I highly suspect it is, but I lifted the backpack up to just get water in there, to see if it would hold, sure enough, the water flowed in (also a factor in why I had the gun on the ground) so yeah, I'm using silicone to reinforce it, please, don't tell me I need PVC PC's, I know that, but as I said earlier I'm still looking. I know the bottle can't hold much pressure. So will silicone work?
(sorry for hijack, but you did get your answer right? So why make a new topic...?)

Silence · 06-10-2006, 09:20 AM

It appears, then, that the problem lies with the seals rather than with the pressure chamber (similarly to highly K-modded soakers). Also, are you saying that water flowed into the bottle when the reservoir was elevated? That might happen when there's barely any pressure, but you'll want to make sure that the water doesn't flow back--which would only happen in the absence of check valves.

Take a look at the plumbing department of Lowes, The Home Depot, or any local plumbing shop--they're bound to have everything you need.

Quote:

Originally Posted by supersoaker

(sorry for hijack, but you did get your answer right? So why make a new topic...?)

I don't seem to understand this, either...

Ben · 06-12-2006, 11:36 AM

I'm not too sure what insanitys_engineer is proposing, but if it is a wooden PC, I doubt that would work well. Wood absorbs water and gets progressively weaker. Using some varnish or something would help, but in the end it would be far more worth it to use a plastic or metal container instead.

Silence · 06-12-2006, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben

I'm not too sure what insanitys_engineer is proposing, but if it is a wooden PC, I doubt that would work well. Wood absorbs water and gets progressively weaker. Using some varnish or something would help, but in the end it would be far more worth it to use a plastic or metal container instead.

I'm assuming the wood gets weaker because it can rot and decompose...but more on the short-term side, it can become extremely heavy (and the extra weight depends on the type of wood). Just a tip, of course...

insanitys_engineer · 06-13-2006, 02:06 PM

The weight of the soaker is something I will consider, and am actually thinking of using some aluminium sheet I have (I love my work) for some of the styling and/or support.
A trigger mech separate to the handle will also be included, and itll be sprung shut so you can do short shots better.

The reason for the wooden tanks, and I can't see many leak problems if I spend a little time sealing them (they will be 9mm ply), is that
+ I can get it much more streamlined: I won't need a 8" high tank out the top.
this has a lot of advantages with the metal methods as any PVC tans will be un peu awkward to connect.
+ It will drain everything: other designs may not drain the whole tank in one or more positions
+ epoxy works on wood VERY well

- It will weigh some, but with the metal construction, it won't make all that much difference compared to having all the tank connectors
- It will take a whole weekend to build and im impatient....

Silence · 06-13-2006, 02:20 PM

Well then, I'm definitely looking forward to pictures of your next soaker...looking at what you did with the brass pieces earlier, I think yet another high-quality masterpiece is about to enter the stage. Good luck with this one, too, and make sure you paint it afterwards--after all, what's the point of having graceful curves if it's going to be spoiled by dull wooden hues?

I, personally, have absolutely no clue as to the strength of such a wooden PC. While PVC is pressure-rated, this isn't; but I'm sure you know with your engineering background, so no worries. Just make sure you're ready for whatever happens

...

insanitys_engineer · 06-13-2006, 03:11 PM

Ill pump it up with a very long stick,and use a string for the trigger

Ill take pictures if I get splintered, but it will be covered in tape to stop shatter. I think the first time I will be expecting like little pissy leaks from the corners.

06-08-2006, 07:35 PM	#1
insanitys_engineer Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: England, kent, south of London Posts: 32 UserID: 679	PC design: some ideas Riddle me this before I go to bed: Everyone is using pre-shaped containers for the PC. Joanna ardway's penguin picture has a gun that looks awesome. Problem is, how to style a homemade gun, and get the PC in? What if you got varnish, or that plastic spray putty, and made a sheet of 3/8" ish ply waterproof. Use the plywood to build the chamber into the styling of the gun, so the outside wall of the PC is the outside wall of the gun. Problems to discuss: Sealing: will silicone bathroom sealant on varnish be enough? Physics: Will a square corenred tank affect the flow in the PC, and does that matter? Strength: Would the wood hold? Thin nails all around the edge, with epoxy glue was my plan. Opinions? If wooden tanks and soaker styling have been discussed elsewhere I apologise, but if not this could be interesting. Ill post some sketches tomorrow, or next week. __________________ Sanity is just an excuse for not having an imagination Water water everywhere, and not a drop to drink.

06-08-2006, 08:20 PM	#2
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,251 UserID: 576	It's a good idea, but the main problem, in my mind, is actually being able to shape the exterior. The fact is, most DIYers who end up building their own soakers are concerned about the performance rather than about the looks--and, in fact, having a plain PVC exterior can be pretty intimidating. However, I have thought about such things, and the easiest method in my mind is to simply use duct tape to cover the empty spaces between tubing. You can also use cardboard paper towel tubes, wood, or anything else for convex portions, as long as you connect everything with duct tape again. However, for more internals accessibility (admittedly hard due to the cement and unnecessary due to the rock-solid reliability), I would just prefer leaving everything open. Being the person that I am, though, I would really find a nice paintjob to be interesting; I have been searching Nerf forums for methods on doing paintjobs like Baghead's ones. He really should write a guide for all the sparkly paintjobs and everything... __________________ Forum Rules

06-12-2006, 11:36 AM	#7
Ben Founder Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 5,985 UserID: 1	I'm not too sure what insanitys_engineer is proposing, but if it is a wooden PC, I doubt that would work well. Wood absorbs water and gets progressively weaker. Using some varnish or something would help, but in the end it would be far more worth it to use a plastic or metal container instead. __________________ email: ben at sscentral dot org / Forum rules Read this page before emailing me. Do not send me a PM or email with a water gun question if someone else could answer the question. Post at the forums. You will get a response from me along with others' views or ideas. Do not send me a PM or email about reading a certain post unless it's been a few days since you've posted. I try to read every post.

06-13-2006, 02:06 PM	#9
insanitys_engineer Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: England, kent, south of London Posts: 32 UserID: 679	The weight of the soaker is something I will consider, and am actually thinking of using some aluminium sheet I have (I love my work) for some of the styling and/or support. A trigger mech separate to the handle will also be included, and itll be sprung shut so you can do short shots better. The reason for the wooden tanks, and I can't see many leak problems if I spend a little time sealing them (they will be 9mm ply), is that + I can get it much more streamlined: I won't need a 8" high tank out the top. this has a lot of advantages with the metal methods as any PVC tans will be un peu awkward to connect. + It will drain everything: other designs may not drain the whole tank in one or more positions + epoxy works on wood VERY well - It will weigh some, but with the metal construction, it won't make all that much difference compared to having all the tank connectors - It will take a whole weekend to build and im impatient.... __________________ Sanity is just an excuse for not having an imagination Water water everywhere, and not a drop to drink.

06-13-2006, 02:20 PM	#10
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,251 UserID: 576	Well then, I'm definitely looking forward to pictures of your next soaker...looking at what you did with the brass pieces earlier, I think yet another high-quality masterpiece is about to enter the stage. Good luck with this one, too, and make sure you paint it afterwards--after all, what's the point of having graceful curves if it's going to be spoiled by dull wooden hues? I, personally, have absolutely no clue as to the strength of such a wooden PC. While PVC is pressure-rated, this isn't; but I'm sure you know with your engineering background, so no worries. Just make sure you're ready for whatever happens ... __________________ Forum Rules

06-08-2006, 08:20 PM	#3
supersoaker Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 24 UserID: 640	Epoxy should work, though I've never used it personally, as long as it doesn't eat through the wood (?) And while we're on this topic, what's the maximum of mL hot glue could hold as a Pc? I tried 1 L it didn't work, and I'm trying 355 ml will it work? if not what will?

06-13-2006, 03:11 PM	#11
insanitys_engineer Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: England, kent, south of London Posts: 32 UserID: 679	Ill pump it up with a very long stick,and use a string for the trigger Ill take pictures if I get splintered, but it will be covered in tape to stop shatter. I think the first time I will be expecting like little pissy leaks from the corners. __________________ Sanity is just an excuse for not having an imagination Water water everywhere, and not a drop to drink.

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