Super Soaker Central forums

joannaardway · 04-25-2006, 05:22 PM

As far as I can tell - a bolt is inserted into the end of the LRT and then a Jubilee clip (do a google search) is put around this and tightened to keep the bolt in and the LRT around it.

What forum mode should I use to sort that? At the moment my partial solution is to set the posts per page to 40, so I can deal with longer threads - it's still limited though.

Silence · 04-25-2006, 05:46 PM

Well, now I can see how the bolt method would work. However, I would probably use the barbed fitting method--there's probably a smaller chance of leaker. I must admit, though, that the bolt will prevent anything from popping out of the LRT.

What did you want to sort? I keep the posts per page to 40 anyway...not that it matters.

Ben · 04-25-2006, 06:44 PM

Both the bolt and barbed fitting methods do not leak. I suppose that the bolt would leak before the barbed fitting would, but we're not approaching that level.

Also, on the subject of cutting into the tubing, the barbed fitting would be the least of your worries. You are far more likely to cut into the tubing with the tubing clamp (also called Jubilee clip) via overtightening, which I have seen occur. Some have recommended putting a layer of electrical tape of the area being clamped so that the clamp cuts into the tape as opposed to the tubing. I do recommend that practice, but I should also say to not fear cutting into the tubing because nothing bad will happen unless you pressurize at that location (which is unlikely because the clamps must go at the end of the tubing!).

Silence · 04-25-2006, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben

I do recommend that practice, but I should also say to not fear cutting into the tubing because nothing bad will happen unless you pressurize at that location (which is unlikely because the clamps must go at the end of the tubing!).

Wouldn't you be using Jubilee clamps at both ends of the LRT? In addition, it shouldn't matter where the pressurization is located, because it will act in all directions.

Thanks for verifying the use of the bolt. I don't think anybody will ever push LRT to the limit where a bolt could leak, because the LRT would split first--McMaster-Carr's website says that the LRT supports no more than 100 psi. Of course, thinner LRT will expand more and have less psi, while thicker LRT might be pushing the limits.

Ben · 04-25-2006, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Wouldn't you be using Jubilee clamps at both ends of the LRT? In addition, it shouldn't matter where the pressurization is located, because it will act in all directions.

Of course. You'd have a hard time keeping the tubing on during pressurization had a tubing clamp been absent. I remember testing that out... I wouldn't suggest even testing it out. The tube shot off violently after inflating a bit, and luckily it did not fill with enough water to turn into a water rocket of sorts. A PC shooting off is essentially a water rocket and is very dangerous.

Silence · 04-25-2006, 07:59 PM

Okay, thanks for verifying that. I'm not going to overtighten the Jubilee clip anyway, considering that it's not going to expand, no matter how much pressure lies within. Thus, the seal will always be there.

EDIT: I guess with overtightening out of the way, there aren't many damaging techniques left. Hopefully this will increase the popularity of CPHs, which as you said somewhere else, are the cheapest and some of the most practical homemades out there.

m15399 · 04-27-2006, 12:07 AM

They are most definately not the cheapest, but they are very practical. I'm more interested in the pressurized piston design, though.

joannaardway · 04-27-2006, 05:51 AM

Pressurized piston - that sounds to me like that stuff I came up with a week or two back... is it or am I off on the wrong track?

CPH's are very practical weapons, as are any CPS types - but any homemade can cost quite a lot.

Silence · 04-27-2006, 10:00 AM

Of course CPHs are great! You only need a little bit of money, a few pumps when in battle, etc. to get great results! Once I finish my PCgH, this will be the next item on my list. I'm thinking of building a CPH with really resistant LRT to allow for really large distances; maybe this can be a good contestant for the 70 feet challenge.

If I remember correctly, the consensus was that there will never be pressure within the pump piston. I'm not sure of the details, so tell me if I'm wrong.

m15399 · 04-27-2006, 07:25 PM

I was referring to the technology in the SuperCanon II. The piston is pushed with pressure, but the water itself is not under any notable amount of pressure. Wasn't sure exactly what to call it.

Ben · 04-27-2006, 08:03 PM

A note to Spinner and joanna: I've been caught up and haven't been able to send the tubing yet, but I should have plenty of time to send the tubing tommorow. I'll let both of you know as soon as the tubing is sent.

As for the potential of an LRT system in getting 70 feet of distance, I wouldn't doubt that it is possible, but it would not be the best way to do it. I was getting into the 60s with my old CPS homemade water gun, so I do suppose that it is easily possible. The problem would be getting more layers over the 7/16" wall tubes. Bike tubes are the only option at the moment because LRT manufacturers do not make tubes with IDs over 1".

Silence · 04-30-2006, 01:19 PM

I don't need an ID greater than one inch--in fact, such tubes would require much thicker walls to obtain pressure similar to that of average LRT. I was thinking of LRT with a small ID and thick walls, coupled with a narrow (3/8 to 1/2 inch diameter) pump. Although this would leave a slightly smaller PC that still takes a while to fill (which doesn't matter with CPS technology), the PC might hold a great amount of pressure and obtain incredible range.

So no, I don't want LRT with a large ID.

Ben · 04-30-2006, 02:33 PM

I don't think that you understand what I was saying. You need a tube with an ID larger than 1" to stack over the two inner tubes. That is the only method of getting a tube thicker than a thickness of 7/16", which is necessary for maximum power. The internal diameter of the tube still will be the 3/8" or whatever it was to begin with. The only difference is the amount of layering, this time with an additional layer.

Also, reducing the ID substantially would be a bad idea. A large ID is necessary to high flow, which is necessary to extended distance. 1/2" essentially is my personal low limit on size when it comes to distance work. You can also stretch a tube with an ID smaller than a certain size over a barbed fitting that is larger, but if the wall is too thick, that's not going to happen.

Silence · 04-30-2006, 03:17 PM

I must not have read your original post too carefully. I should have seen that you meant the LRT used to collusus the rest.

I haven't experimented with LRT too much, so I'll take your word for it that small LRT restricts flow. Thanks for the tip.

04-25-2006, 05:22 PM	#16
joannaardway Do not adjust your TV set Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: SW Hertfordshire, England Posts: 875 UserID: 549	As far as I can tell - a bolt is inserted into the end of the LRT and then a Jubilee clip (do a google search) is put around this and tightened to keep the bolt in and the LRT around it. What forum mode should I use to sort that? At the moment my partial solution is to set the posts per page to 40, so I can deal with longer threads - it's still limited though. __________________ "Over the hills and far away, she prays he will return one day. As sure as the rivers reach the seas, back in his arms again she'll be." - Over the Hills and far away, Gary Moore "So many people have come and gone, their faces fade as the years go by. Yet I still recall as I wander on, as clear as the sun in the summer sky" - More than a feeling, Boston

04-25-2006, 05:46 PM	#17
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,315 UserID: 576	Well, now I can see how the bolt method would work. However, I would probably use the barbed fitting method--there's probably a smaller chance of leaker. I must admit, though, that the bolt will prevent anything from popping out of the LRT. What did you want to sort? I keep the posts per page to 40 anyway...not that it matters. __________________ Forum rules

04-25-2006, 06:44 PM	#18
Ben Founder Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: College Park, Maryland Posts: 6,086 UserID: 1	Both the bolt and barbed fitting methods do not leak. I suppose that the bolt would leak before the barbed fitting would, but we're not approaching that level. Also, on the subject of cutting into the tubing, the barbed fitting would be the least of your worries. You are far more likely to cut into the tubing with the tubing clamp (also called Jubilee clip) via overtightening, which I have seen occur. Some have recommended putting a layer of electrical tape of the area being clamped so that the clamp cuts into the tape as opposed to the tubing. I do recommend that practice, but I should also say to not fear cutting into the tubing because nothing bad will happen unless you pressurize at that location (which is unlikely because the clamps must go at the end of the tubing!). __________________ email: / Forum rules / Read this page before emailing me. Do not send me a PM or email with a water gun question if someone else could answer the question. Post at the forums. You will get a response from me along with others' views or ideas.

04-25-2006, 07:59 PM	#21
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,315 UserID: 576	Okay, thanks for verifying that. I'm not going to overtighten the Jubilee clip anyway, considering that it's not going to expand, no matter how much pressure lies within. Thus, the seal will always be there. EDIT: I guess with overtightening out of the way, there aren't many damaging techniques left. Hopefully this will increase the popularity of CPHs, which as you said somewhere else, are the cheapest and some of the most practical homemades out there. __________________ Forum rules

04-27-2006, 05:51 AM	#23
joannaardway Do not adjust your TV set Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: SW Hertfordshire, England Posts: 875 UserID: 549	Pressurized piston - that sounds to me like that stuff I came up with a week or two back... is it or am I off on the wrong track? CPH's are very practical weapons, as are any CPS types - but any homemade can cost quite a lot. __________________ "Over the hills and far away, she prays he will return one day. As sure as the rivers reach the seas, back in his arms again she'll be." - Over the Hills and far away, Gary Moore "So many people have come and gone, their faces fade as the years go by. Yet I still recall as I wander on, as clear as the sun in the summer sky" - More than a feeling, Boston

04-27-2006, 12:07 AM	#22
m15399 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 224 UserID: 495	They are most definately not the cheapest, but they are very practical. I'm more interested in the pressurized piston design, though.

04-27-2006, 10:00 AM	#24
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,315 UserID: 576	Of course CPHs are great! You only need a little bit of money, a few pumps when in battle, etc. to get great results! Once I finish my PCgH, this will be the next item on my list. I'm thinking of building a CPH with really resistant LRT to allow for really large distances; maybe this can be a good contestant for the 70 feet challenge. If I remember correctly, the consensus was that there will never be pressure within the pump piston. I'm not sure of the details, so tell me if I'm wrong. __________________ Forum rules

04-27-2006, 07:25 PM	#25
m15399 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 224 UserID: 495	I was referring to the technology in the SuperCanon II. The piston is pushed with pressure, but the water itself is not under any notable amount of pressure. Wasn't sure exactly what to call it.

04-27-2006, 08:03 PM	#26
Ben Founder Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: College Park, Maryland Posts: 6,086 UserID: 1	A note to Spinner and joanna: I've been caught up and haven't been able to send the tubing yet, but I should have plenty of time to send the tubing tommorow. I'll let both of you know as soon as the tubing is sent. As for the potential of an LRT system in getting 70 feet of distance, I wouldn't doubt that it is possible, but it would not be the best way to do it. I was getting into the 60s with my old CPS homemade water gun, so I do suppose that it is easily possible. The problem would be getting more layers over the 7/16" wall tubes. Bike tubes are the only option at the moment because LRT manufacturers do not make tubes with IDs over 1". __________________ email: / Forum rules / Read this page before emailing me. Do not send me a PM or email with a water gun question if someone else could answer the question. Post at the forums. You will get a response from me along with others' views or ideas.

04-30-2006, 01:19 PM	#27
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,315 UserID: 576	I don't need an ID greater than one inch--in fact, such tubes would require much thicker walls to obtain pressure similar to that of average LRT. I was thinking of LRT with a small ID and thick walls, coupled with a narrow (3/8 to 1/2 inch diameter) pump. Although this would leave a slightly smaller PC that still takes a while to fill (which doesn't matter with CPS technology), the PC might hold a great amount of pressure and obtain incredible range. So no, I don't want LRT with a large ID. __________________ Forum rules

04-30-2006, 02:33 PM	#28
Ben Founder Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: College Park, Maryland Posts: 6,086 UserID: 1	I don't think that you understand what I was saying. You need a tube with an ID larger than 1" to stack over the two inner tubes. That is the only method of getting a tube thicker than a thickness of 7/16", which is necessary for maximum power. The internal diameter of the tube still will be the 3/8" or whatever it was to begin with. The only difference is the amount of layering, this time with an additional layer. Also, reducing the ID substantially would be a bad idea. A large ID is necessary to high flow, which is necessary to extended distance. 1/2" essentially is my personal low limit on size when it comes to distance work. You can also stretch a tube with an ID smaller than a certain size over a barbed fitting that is larger, but if the wall is too thick, that's not going to happen. __________________ email: / Forum rules / Read this page before emailing me. Do not send me a PM or email with a water gun question if someone else could answer the question. Post at the forums. You will get a response from me along with others' views or ideas.

04-30-2006, 03:17 PM	#29
Silence Administrator Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,315 UserID: 576	I must not have read your original post too carefully. I should have seen that you meant the LRT used to collusus the rest. I haven't experimented with LRT too much, so I'll take your word for it that small LRT restricts flow. Thanks for the tip. __________________ Forum rules

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