valves

Build a homemade water gun or water balloon launcher and tell us about it.
illuzion
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valves

Post by illuzion » Sat May 20, 2006 1:47 pm

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/ ... aster3.htm here is how the super soaker pumping works.
Here is my question which valves i would use to make my own gun? bike valves?

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Silence
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Post by Silence » Sat May 20, 2006 3:16 pm

Welcome to SSC, illuzion :) . The rest of this reply will assume we're talking about standard APHs.

First of all, know that there are a few different types of valves you'll need to use. Check valves (also known as "one-way valves") only let water flow in one direction, so you use them near the pump--they allow water to only go to the pump from the reservoir, and water exiting the pump can only go to the PC. If this is what you wanted, you can go to Lowes (or a local plumbing store) and ask for PVC check valves.

The other type of valve you'll need is a trigger valve. These can be either open or close, and they allow water to flow in both directions. In soakers, they are used between the PC and the nozzle, so to fire, you open the valve. The best type of trigger valve for soakers is a good ball valve, as they open in such a way that there is a near-perfect path for the water to go through--and because there are no obstructions, the stream is very laminated (meaning smooth). If you have a choice, however, use metal ball valves instead of the more popular PVC ball valves; the metal versions open very quickly and with a click, and are the closest to Max-D trigger valves (though they're stronger), and because they can open and close quickly, they are much easier to use when shooting. I believe they use a spring mechanism to get a fast open and close, but I'm not sure. However, if you're going to somehow attach a trigger to a metal ball valve, put a spring behind the trigger to close the ball valve automatically.

illuzion
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Post by illuzion » Sat May 20, 2006 4:14 pm

thank you :) , im going tomorrow to local shop and buy all what i need hehe

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Silence
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Post by Silence » Sat May 20, 2006 8:08 pm

Make sure the place you're going to has all the things you'll need. Generally, for plumbing, Lowes has a larger selection than the Home Depot does; however, plumbing shops are good, too. There should also be some specialist shops if you live in a larger town or in a small/medium-sized city--all I know is that once, purely by accident, I came across a list of O-ring suppliers in my yellow pages.

Good luck with your homemade...

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joannaardway
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Post by joannaardway » Sat May 20, 2006 9:20 pm

I would post some replies, but Silentguy has saved me the bother.

I suppose I should say: "If you have any problems, don't hesitate to ask."
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Scavenger
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Post by Scavenger » Sat May 20, 2006 9:58 pm

SilentGuy wrote:If you have a choice, however, use metal ball valves instead of the more popular PVC ball valves; the metal versions open very quickly and with a click, and are the closest to Max-D trigger valves (though they're stronger), and because they can open and close quickly, they are much easier to use when shooting. I believe they use a spring mechanism to get a fast open and close, but I'm not sure. However, if you're going to somehow attach a trigger to a metal ball valve, put a spring behind the trigger to close the ball valve automatically.

Really? All of the metal ball valves I see at Lowes and Home Depot operate just like a pvc ball valve, except they are easier to turn. Have you seen a valve that does what you describe? That sounds interesting.

Welcome to SSC, illuzion.

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Silence
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Post by Silence » Sat May 20, 2006 10:37 pm

The funny thing is, I wouldn't really know. However, I assume this is so because Duxburian constantly remarks about this, and I still believe him. I would wait for him to respond...

I would assume they act like this due to some special spring mechanism.

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DX
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Post by DX » Sun May 21, 2006 1:51 am

Every non-standard item I use in homemades is there for a reason. However, metal ball valves do operate exactly like their PVC counterparts, with the exception of being easier to turn and faster. You can take tap shots with them, and the difference from a trigger is not that much if you're experienced using them. Metal ball valve handles are also much more comfortable and give you more leverage, although you don't need more leverage. Finally, most are threaded, meaning that you can swap barrels, pcs, nozzles, whatever.
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Silence
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Post by Silence » Sun May 21, 2006 2:28 am

Duxburian brings up a good point about the threads on metal ball valves as well as the knowledge that his experience shows. I, personally, would be happier with male threads on metal ball valves because they are compatible with endcap nozzles and conical nozzles. There's not much advantage to having it this way, and since the valve-to-nozzle piece of PVC might screw off of the valve when you take off a nozzle, you might as well use primer to glue the barrel fitting on.

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DX
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Post by DX » Sun May 21, 2006 2:51 am

ou might as well use primer to glue the barrel fitting on.
Primer is meant to clean and prep the pipe for gluing, but it is not glue and cannot be used as such, it will not hold whatsoever.

Male-threaded ball valves do not exist, at least to my knowledge, if they did, I would have used them a long time ago. However, it only takes 75 cents, a tiny portion of pipe, and a small amount of glue to make the attachment of the barrel. You can get male-threaded-to-female non-threaded couplers, which eliminates the need for the male adaptor in guns such as water launchers/cannons. However, standard homemades still require that extra adaptor if you're using threads. I personally don't mind.
Mess With the Best, Get Soaked Like the Rest!

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Silence
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Post by Silence » Mon May 22, 2006 12:08 am

Well, I vaguely remembered using purple primer somewhere with PVC, so I thought it had something to do with the glue...but I guess I was wrong. Thanks.

How effective would a solenoid be in a homemade soaker (not a WBL or an APWL)? If they open so quickly and very easily, then it would be much easier to do pulse shots and otherwise control the stream, and if they use an external switch, you could easily create a trigger mechanism (though covered in duct tape to prevent short circuiting due to water) near the end of the gun. Do solenoids obstruct the stream, or can they be used with linear flow design like ball valves can?

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DX
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Post by DX » Mon May 22, 2006 12:18 am

You can't get the electronic parts wet. And guns get wet on the outside, usually from enemy action. Plus if I had solenoid in one of my guns today, it would have been ruined by the rain. They would only be effective if you could water-proof it or make sure your gun never got wet on the outside.
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wetmonkey442
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Post by wetmonkey442 » Mon May 22, 2006 12:41 am

Or just use a modified solenoid.

I keep telling people, they're the greatest things for WBLs, but they obstruct the flow like crazy, so it wouldn't do your gun very good. However, a modified solenoid is water-proof, 'tis why I use them in my AWACs.

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Post by CRAZY Homemade » Mon May 22, 2006 12:51 am

It is better to use an high performance metal ball valve, it is a lot cheaper and requires no batteries to short. Also for larger sized pipes, ball valve may be the only way to go.
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wetmonkey442
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Post by wetmonkey442 » Mon May 22, 2006 1:00 am

Modified sprinkler valves have no solenoids, thus, no batteries: no chance to short. You bring up a good point though, with larger pipes ball valves are often the only option, and in many cases, allow for a larger more unobstructed opening. Air takes a crazy path through a solenoid up, and over, underneath a diaghram, and out the other side. It'll create disturbance in the flow, but it doesn't affect air much. The real advantage of using a modified sprinkler valve is the opening time. A modified valve opens in 4 milliseconds. When you are dealing with high pressures, and large volumes of air in a pressure chamber, a sprinkler valve will be the best way to go. That is why they are best used in WBLs.

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