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Old 05-22-2006, 11:03 PM   #16
st_jimmy
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My xenon has very little drop off, about the same as my flash flood actually. idk, but it seems like the quality in these guns is not consistent.
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Old 05-23-2006, 03:25 PM   #17
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@ m15399: It's a little hard to make out the Argon's shot in your video, but congratulations on posting the video link. Seriously--it shows that you're very convinced about the Argon's reduced dropoff, so I'll keep that it in mind. I haven't used my XP 270 or another standard air pressure soaker in quite a while, so that might have even more dropoff. I'll really just have to see...

However, everybody should check out the post in the PCgH thread that I linked to...I hope it'll clear up some of the common PreCharger misconceptions. With pressure relief valves, PreChargers will have dropoff, but the stream is cut off early--basically, because there's no more water left, and not because the dropoff rate is slower.

@ Duxburian: None of the commercial PreChargers have much PC capacity or power (not even the Krypton!), and if you think way back to when I first proposed a PCgH, you'll remember that I intended to greatly increase the PC and nozzle size to remedy this. The only thing PreCharging really does, at least with a pressure relief valve as in the commercial ones, is require fewer but stronger pumps. This year's Xenon only needs four pumps after PreCharging (so it was PreCharged after all), but last year's only used three--though if you filled the PC partially with water and then PreCharged, you could get it to use four or five or more.

@ everybody: PreChargers won't vary too much between models, as they're not using natural rubber, which can have varying properties and dry out over time.
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Old 05-26-2006, 12:30 AM   #18
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well if some people report virtually no dropoff, and others report very significant dropoff, that implies that there is inconsistent quality. I dont care if its not CPS. Especially as Buzz Bee is a fairly small company, they may not have as good quality control.
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Old 05-26-2006, 04:17 PM   #19
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Dropoff is a very relative term, and as I explained in my PCgH article, PreChargers will experience the same amount of dropoff as standard air pressure soakers will, because they use similar techniques--the only difference being that PreChargers have relatively more air (mass-wise) in the PC at all times, and thus relatively more pressure.

If you have been using air pressure guns with very small PC capacity, then you might think that the dropoff in your Xenon (which has a larger PC than my Argon) is minimal. On the other hand, those who use XP 310s, MD6Ks, and the more recent big soakers--or even APHs--might feel that the soaker has lots of dropoff. It's a very relative concept, especially since not everybody knows how to measure dropoff (and PreChargers bring in more factors when comparing dropoff). My Argon has noticable, though not extreme, dropoff, but it's still my favorite weapon--even more so than my CPS 4100.
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Old 05-26-2006, 08:22 PM   #20
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I agree that drop-off is highly relative. It mainly depends on what guns you are used to using. It is not even that much with measuring as it is with simple familiarity. I use mostly modded CPS guns which don't have drop-off, some APHs that don't have much, and some stock CPS guns which don't have it. Other than that, I rarely shoot guns that do have drop-off. I'm the exact same way with shot time: I rarely see anything longer than 5 seconds due to what type of guns I use, so 10 seconds for me is really, really long shot time!

There also isn't any accepted standard for "measuring" drop-off.
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Old 05-27-2006, 11:16 AM   #21
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I believe, for measuring dropoff, there's Ben's derivative method and there's the 70% mark method. However, you is correct--measuring dropoff can get quite complicated, especially upon reading my dropoff article in the PCgH thread.
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