As big as humainly possiable...

Build a homemade water gun or water balloon launcher and tell us about it.
Twisted
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As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Mon Jul 07, 2008 6:04 pm

hey guys, I'm new here =D
Looked round the site, liking what I'm seeing, so i've decided to put my situation to you, as you all sound like educated people :P

OK, me and a few of my mates want to build an uber water cannon. (notice i said cannon, and not gun XD). We are going to build it on a mobile platform, so weight is not an issue, as with size. We have a budget of about £150 (that's about $300).

so, we're all set. It's just we have no idea about how to arm the vehicle. We would like to get a nice, big gun for the main armament, as well as several smaller guns.

So, what do you recommend? If you could build a gun with a $300 budget, unlimited weight and size barriers, what would you make? We're all novices in this feild so any comments would be greatly appreciated (even if it's just to sell the car and go home)

On second thoughts, don't say that please :P

Thx :)

edit: changed spelling of sight to site ><

aEx155
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by aEx155 » Mon Jul 07, 2008 6:34 pm

For simplicity, you could just build a bunch of Super cannon IIs. The Supercannon II is the largest, most powerful (besides the SuperCAP) water cannon on this site, or that I know of.With a little design changes, you could easily make a bunch that would suit your needs.

You could always make a CAP gun, like Ben's CP45. If you make it correctly, you could make that a pretty powerful gun.

Do any of these ideas sound good? They're the biggest guns we have here, and they can be modified for whatever purpose you have.

It would help if you could tell us what you're planning so that you have a more specific direction to go in.

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cantab
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by cantab » Mon Jul 07, 2008 6:49 pm

For a main cannon, I'd consider a water bomb launcher. That'll get more range more cheaply and easily than a gun. Then for a gun I'd probably go with a constant air pressure design, fed via a regulator from an air tank (like a scuba cylinder). In fact everything could run off the same air tank, all using regulators. Though I'm not sure how much they cost.

I'd also add a motorised gun for backup if the air systems fail (or it can become your main if it turns out better than the air pressure one). That's basically just an intake, an engine or motor powering a pump, and a nozzle.

I note you're in England. Over here, pressure rated plastic pipe is hard to find. Since weight's no issue you can use copper quite happily, however that doesn't come larger than 28mm, which might make a truly powerful weapon impossible.

Maplin sell a ('heavy duty') drill powered pump, capable of about 28psi and close to 1 l per second. That's comparable to the CPS 2000, but with continuous flow (well, as long as your water lasts). Then all you need is a power drill, some normal garden hose, a nozzle (consider making your own, garden ones won't perform so well)and you'll probably have one anyway to build the thing in the first place! When I get some money I might try using it as the basis for a gun myself.

Bear in mind you are going to need either a BIG water tank, or a hose to take water from somewhere. In the latter case you might need to design stuff to cope with dirty water, or at least be easily dismantleable for cleaning.

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Mon Jul 07, 2008 6:54 pm

OK, no problem.

We have a MOT failure car that we can fix up (speed restrictor, soft bumpers, SIPS, harnesses and the like to keep it safe). We want to arm it. Water was the obvious option for lack of permanent harm to people on the receiving end and ease of use, as well as cost.

Now, basically we want something to tack weld onto the roof, that will give us a 360 degree feild of fire and can be operated by someone sticking his head up through a hole in the roof. We would like something big, with a decent range (hopefully around 75-100 feet) and is powerful enough to dissuade people from running at it like a half crazed Spartan, ie about riot hose pressure? is that OTT? To be honest we really are clueless in this. The car is fine, we have an automotive engineer on the team.

The supercanon II looks good, but is there any way to increase range? And what kind of effects does it have on the target at long, medium and short ranges?

Thanks for the reply :)
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:04 pm

we have a couple of large, 50 litre water buts, and a compressor akin to this one... ok hyperlink isnt working so ill give a run down.

Brand: Revolution
Colour: Grey, Orange
Safety Cut Out: Yes
Pressure Gauge (Y/N): Yes
Warranty/guarantee details: 12mths Guarantee
WEEE Requirements: Elec & Electronic Tools
Manuf part no: 27259108
Electric/Petrol: Electric
Product Type: Compressors & Sprayers
Output Pressure: 8bar 116psi

Do you think you could explain the motorised gun concept a little more pls? Or a link? thanks :)

And as for the piping, is there any alternative to 28mil copper pipe?

Thanks again for all your assistance, it realy is appreciated.
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

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SSCBen
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by SSCBen » Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:11 pm

Maplin sell a ('heavy duty') drill powered pump, capable of about 28psi and close to 1 l per second. That's comparable to the CPS 2000, but with continuous flow (well, as long as your water lasts). Then all you need is a power drill, some normal garden hose, a nozzle (consider making your own, garden ones won't perform so well)and you'll probably have one anyway to build the thing in the first place! When I get some money I might try using it as the basis for a gun myself.
Two of those in series should double your pressure but keep the flow the same, which is intriguing. Definitely worth looking into.
Now, basically we want something to tack weld onto the roof, that will give us a 360 degree feild of fire and can be operated by someone sticking his head up through a hole in the roof. We would like something big, with a decent range (hopefully around 75-100 feet) and is powerful enough to dissuade people from running at it like a half crazed Spartan, ie about riot hose pressure? is that OTT? To be honest we really are clueless in this. The car is fine, we have an automotive engineer on the team.
75 to 100 feet is very long range for a water gun. It's possible but you need a lot of water flow. 3.5 liters per second I would consider a minimum for over 70 feet of range. I'd suggest toning down the power unless you have a 100+ liter container that you can pressurize.

You basically have two options: pressurizing a large container and adding tubes leading to a gun and using some sort of electric/gas water pump.

The electric/gas water pump route gets very expensive fast from what I've seen and you'll probably end up spending most of your budget on just one pump. Factoring in batteries or gasoline, a water container, tubing, etc., and you'll probably go over budget.

What sort of large pressurized containers are there in the UK? I've considered pressurizing a propane tank I have that looks rather significant. Large air compressor tanks should work too and should fit your budget. Steel drums could work too. If you can get some large chambers to pressurize that would probably be the most straightforward way to do this. You'll have to take them to a welding shop to get ports put on them like the Ubersoaker but aside from what it should be straightforward.

Can these water containers you mentioned be pressurized? I wasn't familiar with the term so I looked it up. Seems water butts are just rainwater collectors and not intended to be pressurized. I could be wrong though.

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:21 pm

Ben wrote: Can these water containers you mentioned be pressurized? I wasn't familiar with the term so I looked it up. Seems water butts are just rainwater collectors and not intended to be pressurized. I could be wrong though.
yer, they're just rainwater collectors, so compressing them may not be the best of ideas.

For air alone scuba tanks may be an option, but for water as well I'm not sure. Propane gas tanks may work, got a few of those, but they are quite big and heavy and i suppose we would have to fiddle with the valves
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

aEx155
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by aEx155 » Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:23 pm

Twisted wrote:To be honest we really are clueless in this.
I would suggest you read this page on how water guns work, so you get an idea of what you're trying to do.
Twisted wrote:Do you think you could explain the motorised gun concept a little more pls? Or a link? thanks :)
If you're using a motorized pump, you can do one of two things:
1) The output of the pump is directly connected to the pump. When the pump is on, the gun is firing; when the pump is off, no water is firing. That is if you have a high flow, high pressure pump.
2) The pump's output is connected to a pressure tank, which is then connected to a trigger valve and nozzle. When the pump is on, it pressurizes the tank. You fire from the tank, not the pump, so this is good if you have a high pressure, low flow pump.

Since you have an air compressor, I would suggest something along the lines of an air-powered water pump, in the first or second configuration. It would be higher pressure and flow than a drill powered pump, and you already have an air-compressor.

Example of an air powered pump here.

EDIT: Didn't see Ben's or Twisted posts.

You could always try making your own air-powered pumps to get the price down; otherwise, if the flow and pressure are good enough, you may only need a pump and a nozzle.

How big are the propane tanks you have? If they're pretty large, then you might be able to do a scaled up CAP design (I'm right to say CAP, right? Since SCUBA is pressurized air and not something else?) which should provide good water pressure without too much cost.
Last edited by aEx155 on Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:25 pm

Wikid, thanks, ill start reading :)
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

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Silence
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Silence » Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:50 am

Ooh...make sure you get some pictures once it's built! :cool:

What type of power source do you want? Electric? Gasoline? Both are possible, and we know of at least one gas-powered water cannon. That's probably the closest to what you want.

More later...and a belated welcome aboard. :)

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Tue Jul 08, 2008 8:40 am

Will do :D
And thanks for the welcome :)

The cannon would be electric, but to make power for the compressor we would have to have a gasoline genorator, me thinks. I dunno, would it be more economicaly sensible to sell the compressor and just make it petrol?
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

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cantab
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by cantab » Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:10 pm

Aren't you putting it in/on a car? In which case, there's your power source right there! You might wanna check what the alternator and wiring can handle though. Or you could quite possibly figure out a way to get drive directly from the engine.

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:15 pm

Yes, but we are putting a speed restrictor on the engine block, which would severly reduce the amount of energy we could get from it.
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

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cantab
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by cantab » Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:16 pm

What is that exactly?

If you think the engine might not provide enough power directly, the battery could still help make up the shortfall, though then you're limited by the charge.

Twisted
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Re: As big as humainly possiable...

Post by Twisted » Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:23 pm

a speed restrictor reduces to RPM of the motor. Keeping it safe :cool:

We could use a car battery, but, as you say, the charge would be a restricting factor for up to 4 high power water cannons. We could get a few i supose, but also bear in mind we would have to get an DC to AC converter in order to run the compressor, which can be quite expensive for a high optimum output.
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather did. not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

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