just a few questions on cps

Build a homemade water gun or water balloon launcher and tell us about it.
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errolprowse
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just a few questions on cps

Post by errolprowse » Fri Mar 24, 2006 5:48 pm

http://www.sscentral.org/images/dscn0190.jpg

i saw this water gun and its exactly what i want, all i need to know how to do is get the one way valve and the pump, ive seen other guys just put a dowel with a washer ring thing around it and it will work fine, but i want something a bit more durable, oh and how much is that rubber and can i just get the stuff at home depot? oh and do u think there is any one way valves at home depot, thanks

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m15399
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Post by m15399 » Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:23 pm

Wow. You've obviously not done much research huh? Well, I guess the forum is a good place to start.

The one way valves you can buy at a store. Home Depot has been known to not have them, so Lowes is usually the prefered retailer. The other way you can get a pump is to buy one from McMaster.com. I'll help you look for it later, not sure where it is exactly. The rubber tubing MUST be bought online from McMaster.com, or a similar place. Depending on the size, it can be $1-$7 a foot.

Do you live in the U.S.? If you don't, it's going to be hard to get the rubber tubing and maybe even the other parts.

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joannaardway
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Post by joannaardway » Fri Mar 24, 2006 9:19 pm

I'm sorry but I have to start with a negative point.

errolprowse, your post needs rewriting. I know I am not in a position of power here, but I feel that you should read the rules: http://forums.sscentral.org/t3324/ ( <- I believe that is correct)

Suggestions to improve your posting: (ALL of these are the rules, apart from perhaps the last one)
-You have not capitalised any letters in your post (including I).
-It would be easier to read if it were on several lines, and probably should have been split into more sentences.
-Abbreviation of "you" to "u" is not sensible. Texts charge you for excessive length, this forum does not. (at least, I hope not, otherwise I'm in financial trouble)
-And PLEASE, Do not say "oh and ..." in posts. This is not conversation. You do not need to interrupt yourself.

Check valves aren't hard to find if you look in the right places, but being from the UK, I don't know which US stores to go to.

My understanding is that a CPH is perhaps not the best choice for a first homemade, so I advise you take care, and ask if on the forums you have problems.

(I am making the reasonable assumption that you have not yet built homemades based on the questions in your post)

As a question of a similar calibre, where should I search for latex tubing within the UK?
"Over the hills and far away, she prays he will return one day. As sure as the rivers reach the seas, back in his arms again she'll be." - Over the Hills and far away, Gary Moore

"So many people have come and gone, their faces fade as the years go by. Yet I still recall as I wander on, as clear as the sun in the summer sky" - More than a feeling, Boston

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SSCBen
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Post by SSCBen » Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:45 pm

Welcome to Super Soaker Central errolprowse!

First off, read our website. Despite our website being terrible outdated compared to what we know today, it still will answer 90% of your questions. To answer each individual question specifically:

Check valves (one-way valves) can be bought at most home improvement stores, though admittedly I have not had luck buy at Home Depot, so avoid them. Lowes nearly always has a good selection of different sizes. Alternatively, you can buy them online at McMaster-Carr.

As for the pump, the method you have mentioned work excellently especially when lubricated and when multiple O-rings are used. If you are looking for something more durable or professional, you could buy a more dedicated water pump and remove the check valves from it so that it can be attached to your water gun. Such water pumps can be found at the McMaster-Carr website I mentioned earlier. If you want a good homemade pump, use multiple O-rings and secure them on with tape such as duct tape or electrical tape.

As for the rubber tubing, it is called latex rubber tubing and is also available on McMaster-Carr. Look for the 35 PSI tube there (it should be 3/16" ID, but I don't have the remained of the details off the top of my head). Expect to pay about $5 per foot of the tubing I mentioned, depending on how the price fluxtuates. If you want to add more power from the latex rubber tubing, ask and I'll explain or do a search for a post where I explain.

Good luck with the homemade water gun. Feel free to ask any question, that is why we have this forum after all. Just remember that our website is a great resource too, and it should be used first, before the forums. ;)
As a question of a similar calibre, where should I search for latex tubing within the UK?
Finding the tubing was a problem with Spinner from what I remember too. You might have some success asking him where to go, that is, given that he eventually found a place to look. Also ask for the alternative names "surgical tubing" or even the more general "rubber tubing" because you may be able to find something like that. From what I know, surgeons use the tubing for a few things, so it should be available in most highly developed areas.

Try a few online manufacturers as well (one I remember well is Kent-Elastomer). Do a Google search for "latex tubing," especially on their Froogle search engine which should filter out online stores that do not ship to the UK. I have also heard about services that will take a package that will only be shipped in the US and ship it to UK. I might be able to send you a little bit tubing if I buy some new tubing as well (free of cost of course).

If someone buys a large amount of rubber tubing and sells it in the UK, they could make a lot of money...

errolprowse
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Post by errolprowse » Sat Mar 25, 2006 1:17 am

thanks alot, i was looking every where for a one way valve thing, ill reply more later, i have to get going to something right now, bye

ok, i want to have a high pressure type of water gun, but does that pvc pipe really hold up to it? oh and the pump, could u just use a bike pump?
Last edited by SSCBen on Sun Mar 26, 2006 2:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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joannaardway
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Post by joannaardway » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:59 pm

Your posting skills appear not to have improved, however I will answer your questions.

Bike pumps can only be used for a pressurized reservior gun, not a CPS or seperate pressure chamber weapon, so no a bike pump cannot be used.

Bike pumps pump air from the outside atmosphere into the system, not like a water pump, which pumps water from the tanks into seperate PCs

Most PVC should handle CPS pressures.
(CPS never reaches above about 35-40 psi, air pressure can hit 120+ psi),

However you should buy pressure rated PVC specifically - this can handle pressures up above 150+ psi (which almost no watergun will ever reach) at temperatures way above anywhere you will ever use it (unless perhaps you live in Death valley [or whatever it's named])

As a side note, I have a standard 1L plastic bottle that withstands a pressure difference of 100+ psi without trouble, and this is massively less durable than PVC (even non-pressure rated stuff). The biggest danger with a homemade is a poor joint failing.

Ben, that is an excellent idea - I should see how possible it would be to set up a water gun part UK middle man scheme. I'll go and set up a poll to see who would be interested.
"Over the hills and far away, she prays he will return one day. As sure as the rivers reach the seas, back in his arms again she'll be." - Over the Hills and far away, Gary Moore

"So many people have come and gone, their faces fade as the years go by. Yet I still recall as I wander on, as clear as the sun in the summer sky" - More than a feeling, Boston

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SSCBen
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Post by SSCBen » Sat Mar 25, 2006 3:09 pm

First, please do not double post. There is an edit button for a reason. I'll edit your second post in momentarily. Please do not double post unless you have good reason to do so.

I have only said this in half of my recent posts, but rubber CPS does not operate on pressure! It operates on the expansion of the rubber. No real amount of pressure is created, in fact, any pressure created would quickly expand to a larger volume because the rubber tubing allows for expansion.

For that reason, the PVC shouldn't have any trouble with the pressure. The force of the chamber, however, might be significant had a chamber in excess of several inches been used, but that simply would be impossible to create.

Bike pumps also pump air, so they can not be used.

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joannaardway
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Post by joannaardway » Sat Mar 25, 2006 3:23 pm

I am aware that CPS weapons do not use "pressure", but nonetheless, psi ratings are still used to indicate power in these cases, so I am using the term.

However, a lack of any "pressure" from the chamber would mean that CPS weapons didn't work - there would be no reason for the water to move out of the chamber - it has to still exert some force.
"Over the hills and far away, she prays he will return one day. As sure as the rivers reach the seas, back in his arms again she'll be." - Over the Hills and far away, Gary Moore

"So many people have come and gone, their faces fade as the years go by. Yet I still recall as I wander on, as clear as the sun in the summer sky" - More than a feeling, Boston

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m15399
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Post by m15399 » Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:48 pm

No pressure just means that nothing is compressed. The water is the same size as it always is. In air pressure, the air is compressed and takes up less and less space. CPS guns push the water out the front without needing any pressure. You said it yourself:
it has to still exert some force
Force, but not pressure.

PVC should be able to hold up against CPS force easily. As long as you glued the parts on tight, nothing's going to fly off. ;)

errolprowse
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Post by errolprowse » Sat Mar 25, 2006 8:45 pm

i see you guys keep talking about my forum rules, im sorry, but i am getting everything you guys are talking to me about, and it helps a whole lot, thanks for awnsering my questions.

do you have any links to home made tutorials?

do you just glue the valve to the pvc?(i found a one way valve, but it wasnt a pvc, it was a metal type, so do you put the valve inside of a piece of pvc pipe)?

is there a type of trigger system for the guns instead of a lever?

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m15399
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Post by m15399 » Sun Mar 26, 2006 12:24 am

Do you know how fittings work? Because it doesn't seem like it. A check valve is just like any other fitting. You put two peices of PVC into each side of it.

Trigger systems can be made, but since you seem pretty new to the tech realm, I would stay with things that are documented. As far as I know, no one has made a homemade super soaker with a true trigger (I have designs drawn up, though).

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SSCBen
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Post by SSCBen » Sun Mar 26, 2006 2:59 am

do you have any links to home made tutorials?
Why don't you try looking on our website for once? I don't mean to sound demanding, but the resources are here and I can't be there with you to make sure that you see them.

Also, no definitive guide has been written on the CPS homemade water gun as of yet, but I am working slowly on one.
do you just glue the valve to the pvc?(i found a one way valve, but it wasnt a pvc, it was a metal type, so do you put the valve inside of a piece of pvc pipe)?
We'd need more information to know what sort of metal check valve you are in possesion of. There are two types - threaded and welded. Threaded valves will thread (screw-on in simple terms) onto a male threaded adaptor. Those would be easier to use in this case. Welded on the other hand must be welded onto metal pipe to be used, and would not be very appropriate for a water gun made of plastic pipe.
is there a type of trigger system for the guns instead of a lever?
Sure there is. You can make a trigger system if you were set enough. However, only one person has successfully created a working trigger system for homemade water guns or homemade Nerf guns. I think you should stick with a simple ball valve for your first homemade water gun.

errolprowse
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Post by errolprowse » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:29 pm

alright, thanks, time for me to go to home depot and mcmastercarr, thanks everyone

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