Crime bill to target replica guns

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Spinner
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Post by Spinner » Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:39 am

BBC story: Crime bill targets replica guns
It was feared that those who use imitation firearms in films and on television, and children who play with water pistols or toy guns, could be criminalised.

But the bill has been drafted so the ban will exclude people who fall into these categories.
^ Here's hoping that it stays like that. No soakers would be tough, to say the least. I don't blame Big Bee for avoiding designing their soakers like real guns.
Air weapons are also being targeted, with the age limit for buying or firing one without supervision being raised from 17 to 18.
Makes me wonder, will that include Nerf guns such as the AirTechs? Or will it solely be referring to actual air guns?
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Post by ANNIHILATOR 2 » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:33 pm

Originally posted by Spinner@Jun 9 2005, 04:39 AM
BBC story: Crime bill targets replica guns
It was feared that those who use imitation firearms in films and on television, and children who play with water pistols or toy guns, could be criminalised.

But the bill has been drafted so the ban will exclude people who fall into these categories.


^ Here's hoping that it stays like that. No soakers would be tough, to say the least. I don't blame Big Bee for avoiding designing their soakers like real guns.

Air weapons are also being targeted, with the age limit for buying or firing one without supervision being raised from 17 to 18.


Makes me wonder, will that include Nerf guns such as the AirTechs? Or will it solely be referring to actual air guns?
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I belive it will target "replica" guns only. Soakers and Nerf are far from that looking nothing like a real gun. If this is a UK law, you guys got easy of. Replica guns are starting to get banned in Canada, and it will even affect adults. So even 18+ people can't buy them.
The reason why I quit airsoft.

Replica guns would include, Airsoft, Cap Guns, Decorational non-historic replicas, dart, waterguns and toy guns in general that resemble a 1:1 scale existing model. So Soakers, Nerf and Paintball should be fine since they don't resemble any existing firearm.
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Post by Monsoon » Fri Jun 10, 2005 8:41 pm

I haven't heard of this, but I think that it's a good idea. Raising ages above 18 to own a gun is a smart move for Canada and Columbine incidents will be much harder to do here.
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Post by emperor_james » Sat Jun 11, 2005 3:02 am

Originally posted by Monsoon@Jun 10 2005, 03:41 PM
I haven't heard of this, but I think that it's a good idea. Raising ages above 18 to own a gun is a smart move for Canada and Columbine incidents will be much harder to do here.
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He meant that 18+ year-olds won't be able to own replica guns anymore.

But Canada has about 1/8 as many gun murders on average than the United States anyway.

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Post by Spinner » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:55 am

I would guess that the UK has less gun murders than either the USA or Canada, but I have no figures. The only gun massacre I can think of was the Dunblane tragedy, when some paedophile attacked a primary school in Scotland. :(

After that, gun laws were further tightened, I believe. It was already harder to get a gun here than in the USA.
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Post by death angel » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:54 am

That's kind of creepy that people could turn replica guns in to real ones. If you look on the site, there is an article about someone who was killed by a replica gun that had been modded to fire real ammunition. That's scary.
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Post by ANNIHILATOR 2 » Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:54 am

WHat kind of a replica was it? I assume that the FPS of the replica would have been increased in that case, since otherwise Airsoft guns can't be turned into real firearms. It probably might got modded with some extra strong gas or extra powerful AEG spring that would jack up the FPS to 500-600. To put that into perspective, a real firearm shoots 1300-1500 FPS. The average Airsoft just shoots 200-350 FPS. To cut skinn, the FPS has to be 400 FPS.( A soaker has a FPS of 20-30.)
Other than that, replicas and "real steel" guns have completely different internal components. Its virtualy impossible to turn an airsoft into a real firearm.

The reason for the replica ban in Canada is not necessarly because of gun related murders, but of many minors and some adults vandalizing and robbing convinient stores with replicas. Canada gun owners have to get registered and own a licence to have a gun or buy amunition. It makes gun related crimes easier to track that way. But for a replica, all you need is to be 18+ to buy one. The Canada Replica ban was introdused just last year, so its still somewhat in the grey zone and many stores still sell replicas but at a much higher price than in the US.
In any case, if you like airsoft and live in Canada, then you are screwed. Even Airsoft guns in clear or bright colours are still prohibited.

Now having said that, stock replicas over around 400 FPS are allowed in Canada since they already count as BB guns, which are used for hunting. In other words, Replicas that shoot below 400 FPS like Airsoft are banned since other than games they only serve as vandalizing and robbery tools.
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Post by Neuro » Wed Jun 15, 2005 4:00 am

For some reason I wouldnt' be surprised if someone was able to mod an airsoft gun to fire real ammunition. Granted it would only last a few shots since the construction is plastic, but there are many similar parts - especially in gas pistols. Also, many real 9mm pistols only shoot ~850fps.
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Post by ANNIHILATOR 2 » Wed Jun 15, 2005 6:59 pm

If someone would be able to do that, it would no longer be a mod, and more actual gun parts with an airsoft frame. The weight of an actual bullet and the magazine that will only fit bbs would mean that the original airsoft magazine needs to go. If its a gas gun, then thats a problem since one has then to build an actual gun magazine that can be filled with gas, since thats where the gas is loaded. The barrel of an airsoft gun is to narrow for most actual bullets. So that one needs to go to. Same with the slide and the frame barrel that only fits the bb barel. Granted, there are some metal bbs, but its not just the barrel that would need replacement. The airsoft would need an actual hammer and actual safety. Also it will need a lot of actual gun internal parts to create the chemical explosion to fire a bullet. There is another problem to. Guns with sucky frames can blow up in someones hand. So a plastic frame will not be pleasant.
In short, after spending a lot of cash and a lot of work hours, 80% would be actual gun parts, where the rest is airsoft left overs. It would be like modding a real gun to be more airsofty. Airsoft are still toys ultimatly(even if some airsoft fanatics might want to believe otherwise.) Turning an Airsoft gun into a real firearm is like turning a CPS 2500 into a real firearm. Virtualy impossible without replacing 80%-90% of its parts.
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Post by emperor_james » Wed Jun 15, 2005 9:48 pm

A2 is right, it would unrealistic to try to turn an airsoft gun into a real gun, and pointless in the end. Also, it would be even more unrealistic to try to get an airsoft gun to lethal FPS (around 4000 I beleive).

Just a side note, many airsoft guns go well over 350 FPS. My M15A4 Carbine is at about 400 FPS (M120 spring), my M15A4 rifle is at around 460 FPS (M140 spring+upgraded internals and custom battery), and my M24 is at around 520 FPS (M160 spring, gas cylinder and lots of upgraded internals.

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Post by ANNIHILATOR 2 » Fri Jun 17, 2005 9:07 am

4000 FPS? That sounds fairly high. From what I read depending on the shells, shotguns reach 1400-1600 FPS. Handguns are 1200-1400 FPS.

I heared of those new Airsoft springs that upgrade the FPS to 600 FPS. But if Im not mistaken, these would be mainly for AEGs. Its somewhat difficult to sneak AEGs into a bank or a store since they are almost always rifles. Airsoft Hand guns that are mainly GBB, EBB, AEP and Springers would not have these kind of powerful springs available to upgrade. Then again, my knowledge and focus in airsoft has been mainly springers, so I might be wrong. One thing is for sure, there won't be a poor sucker who would spend time trying to turn an EBB pistol into a real firearm.(For non-airsoft people, even the best brand EBBs just shoot 50 feet max and the engine burns out after 3-6 months of heavy use.)
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Post by emperor_james » Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:12 pm

Just because a something reaches 1200 FPS doesn't mean its as effective as a real firearm. An airsoft BB is around .2 grams, while I beleive the 5.56mm rounds from the M16 (which themselves are notorious for not penetrating) weigh about 12 grams.

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Post by ANNIHILATOR 2 » Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:13 am

Originally posted by emperor_james@Jun 17 2005, 03:12 PM
Just because a something reaches 1200 FPS doesn't mean its as effective as a real firearm. An airsoft BB is around .2 grams, while I beleive the 5.56mm rounds from the M16 (which themselves are notorious for not penetrating) weigh about 12 grams.
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Oh ok. So you converted the real firearm FPS into what it would be in 0.2g stats? Just curious where the 4000 FPS comes from.
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Post by death angel » Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:14 pm

He's saying to make an airsoft gun lethal it would have to reach 4000 FPS. A real gun, because the bullet a so much heavier, can do more damge at a lower speed.
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Post by emperor_james » Sat Jun 18, 2005 10:25 pm

Sort of, it was an estimate for about the FPS to be able to kill people at close range with a .2 gram BB (somewhat more powerful than a hunting BB gun).

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